HARO’s comeback: Modern sourcing for journalists and brands

In this episode, Brett Farmiloe joins host Jason Mudd to discuss the comeback of HARO and smarter PR pitching.

Tune in to learn more!

Watch the episode here:

Meet our guest:

 Our episode guest is Brett Farmiloe, founder and CEO at Help a Reporter Out (HARO). Brett has scaled startups and worked with global brands, and he helps professionals share their expertise online. His mission is to make knowledge more accessible and human. 

5 things you’ll learn during the full episode:

1. Why using AI only to offload tasks can lower quality and why thinking first matters
2. What Martin predicted correctly about AI and what surprised him about its rapid adoption
3. How to move beyond basic content generation to strategy and analytics
4. Why subject-matter expertise is critical when using AI for insights and data
5. How leaders can manage hype, train teams, and stay ethical as AI evolves

Listen to the episode here:

More about Brett Farmiloe

Brett Farmiloe is the CEO of Help a Reporter Out (HARO), a platform connecting journalists with sources to create expert-powered content. An entrepreneur and author, Brett has scaled startups, collaborated with global brands, and helped thousands of professionals share their expertise. His mission is to make knowledge more accessible and human online. 

Quotables

• “Our goal at the end of the day is to connect journalists with great sources for stories.” — Brett Farmiloe
• “When sources come to us and they're like, ‘What do I do here? How do I be helpful?’ It's really in the HARO acronym: It's be Helpful, be Authentic, be Relevant, and be On time.” — Brett Farmiloe
• “Be authentic; don't just use 100% AI, and add your own human expertise to things.” — Brett Farmiloe
• “What comes around, goes around, and I really think that just being helpful and friendly and nice to people goes a long way.” — Jason Mudd

If you enjoyed this episode, please take a moment to share it with a colleague or friend. You may also support us through Buy Me a Coffee or by leaving us a quick podcast review.

Resources

Guest’s contact info and resources:

• @BrettFarmiloe on X
• Brett Farmiloe on LinkedIn
• Help a Reporter Out website
• Featured website
• Listen to more episodes of the On Top of PR with Jason Mudd podcast.
• Find out more about Axia Public Relations.

Additional Resources:

• 6 tips for using HARO to pitch your story
• HARO Shifts to Connectively: What does this mean for PR professionals?
• Authentic PR: Giving it a human touch
• PR pros have a new way to connect with reporters

If you like this episode, you're going to love this:

• How to improve your media pitches
• Building relationships with Peter Shankman
• Making your media pitches stand out with Qwoted

Recorded: November 10, 2025

About your host Jason Mudd

Jason Mudd is a nationally recognized public relations expert featured by CNN, Entrepreneur, Forbes, NPR, The New York Times, PRWeek, and The Wall Street Journal.

Named North America’s top PR leader by the World Communication Forum, he serves as CEO of Axia Public Relations — recognized by Forbes as one of America’s Best PR Agencies.

Jason has advised some of the country’s most admired and fastest-growing companies, leading campaigns for iconic brands including American Airlines, Budweiser, Dave & Buster’s, GE, H&R Block, Hilton, HP, Miller Lite, New York Life, Pizza Hut, Southern Comfort, and Verizon.

He’s also a professional public speaker, accredited PR practitioner, published author, entrepreneur, and host of On Top of PR with Jason Mudd — a podcast ranked among the top 3% globally by Listen Notes and a top 100 marketing podcast on Apple Podcasts. His guests have included leaders from Disney, Mall of America, Priceline, Southwest Airlines, Tyson Foods, and Wells Fargo.

Find more On Top of PR episodes on: 

Transcript

00:00:00:03 - 00:00:12:18

Brett

generally speaking, when when sources come to us and they're like, what do I do here? And how do I how do I be helpful? I think it's really in the Hero acronym. It's be helpful, be authentic, be relevant, and be on time.

00:00:12:20 - 00:00:30:06

Brett

Being being helpful is basically just saying, hey, if I were in the shoes of this journalist, if this is a helpful pitch, be authentic is just don't use 100% AI and add your own human expertise to things. Be relevant. Make sure that you have the credentials and be on time as journalists are on deadline, and they need to get connected with the source quickly.

00:00:30:06 - 00:00:35:11

Brett

So the faster that you can respond to that journalist and be helpful, the better success that you'll have.

00:00:35:11 - 00:00:45:10

Announcer

Welcome to On Top of PR with Jason Mudd.

00:00:45:10 - 00:00:54:22

Jason

Hello, and welcome to On top of PR, I'm your host, Jason Mudd with Axia Public Relations. And today we're talking about help a reporter out Haro. Haro however you pronounce it. Haro Haro.

00:00:54:22 - 00:01:20:11

Jason

It's back. And we're excited to welcome our guest, Brett Farmer lo. He is the CEO of help a Reporter Out, a platform that connects journalists with sources to create expert powered content. And entrepreneur and author Brett has skilled startups, worked with global brands, and helped thousands of professionals share their expertise. His mission make knowledge more accessible and more human online.

00:01:20:13 - 00:01:23:08

Jason

Brett, I'd like to welcome you to On top of PR.

00:01:23:11 - 00:01:24:17

Brett

Thanks for having me.

00:01:24:19 - 00:01:51:26

Jason

Yeah, I'm glad to have you. I'm glad to be here. It's been a minute since we recorded a new episode, and, Brett, you and I have talked about getting together, to do this for a while. I know my audience is interested about our topic today. The comeback of Haro modern sourcing for journalists and brands. As we were talking before we pressed record, you know, I grew up in the BMX era, and I had a Haro bike, which was spelt the same way as Haro.

00:01:51:28 - 00:02:09:14

Jason

And some of my friends called it Haro, some of it called it Haro. I've always called this service Haro, and other people called it Haro. So I guess we'll just use the term interchangeably. But because of the way the founder, Peter Shankman pronounces it, that's where you've decided to land. Is that right?

00:02:09:16 - 00:02:14:25

Brett

That's right. Haro and I might have to pick up a BMX bike.

00:02:14:27 - 00:02:36:02

Jason

Well, they're still around. You know, I looked at getting one for nostalgic purposes, but, the bank account and the, you know, the, fitness level probably aren't a good idea. Plus my size, I'm way bigger than I was back then. So, Brett, tell me, why did you buy and revive, this platform that was at one point, extremely popular.

00:02:36:05 - 00:03:00:19

Brett

Yeah. I think that there was just a great opportunity to bring it back. So the back story is that it was founded in 2008. It was, ran until about April 24th, when it was rebranded to collectively. And then in December of 24, it was announced that it was going to be discontinued. And so I reached out with, cold email to the general support line and said, hey, I'm interested.

00:03:00:21 - 00:03:07:26

Brett

And we ended up putting a deal across the finish line and reviving it. In April of 2025.

00:03:07:28 - 00:03:17:27

Jason

Well, that's pretty cool. I wish I would have thought about that, but, good for you. And, what was kind of your your passion and wanting to bring it back?

00:03:17:29 - 00:03:39:14

Brett

Yeah, I think that, you know, it's such a good, nostalgic, brand for so many people. So many people got their first media mention or a journalist's remember hero in a place where, they were, you know, up against deadline and needed a source right away. And so I think that's been one of the biggest surprises in bringing that back is just how prominent of a brand it really was.

00:03:39:14 - 00:03:48:01

Brett

And, we're out to make it another, you know, brand that that does serve, a use and being helpful for, for many.

00:03:48:04 - 00:04:00:14

Jason

Got it. Got it. So what's changed? What have you done since you've purchased it? To kind of resurrect it? And I'm assuming you identified what was good and what needed to be improved and working on taking it to that next level. Right?

00:04:00:16 - 00:04:24:14

Brett

Yeah, definitely. I think that step one, bring it back. It was it was great to, you know, connect people, connect journalists with sources for stories via email. And, we wanted to bring that back as step one. And, you know, the reason why it was discontinued are many reasons why I think that, you know, a lot of, I use spam started to plague the platform.

00:04:24:14 - 00:04:43:20

Brett

And so, bringing it back in its original form is easier said than done. So we've had to institute a lot of different checks, spam detection methods, to make sure that those connections between journalists and sources is going to be authentic. So, that's step one for us, and we're looking forward to moving on to step two and three.

00:04:43:23 - 00:04:47:04

Jason

Got it, got it. So what's what's next in those steps.

00:04:47:07 - 00:05:10:17

Brett

Yeah. So I think that we look at a couple different pillars and it all goes back to this premise of be helpful, be helpful to reporters and journalists. And what the journalists and reporters need today, besides just sources for stories. I think that, you know, the the biggest thing that we're realizing, you know, as we talk with more and more journalists is just how like, how crazy it is to be a journalist today.

00:05:10:20 - 00:05:30:24

Brett

I mean, I think that when I, when I interview, and speak with different journalists, ask them about how it's going. And, you know, the thing that I've taken away is that journalists are now having multiple different streams of income. And so be helpful for us is around how do we support and amplify those existing streams of income.

00:05:30:24 - 00:05:55:18

Brett

And so we're going to be coming out here pretty soon with hero journalist profiles. So basically tapping into the authority for the domain and being able to use that domain authority to help support and connect journalists with different writing opportunities, to connect them with different subscribers for their Substack, to really drive passive income, so that they're able to focus on on what they do best.

00:05:55:21 - 00:06:15:18

Jason

Let's talk about that passive income for a minute that you mentioned or, or outside income. I don't want anybody listening to our podcast to, come to the wrong conclusion or assumption. So, you know, I it's not unusual that I hear from an entrepreneur who doesn't understand how PR works. And they think, well, certainly I could just pay a journalist to write about me or something like that.

00:06:15:18 - 00:06:21:22

Jason

So, let's be clear about what you're seeing these other journalists do for additional income or side income.

00:06:21:24 - 00:06:43:14

Brett

Yeah, definitely. Thanks for the opportunity to clarify that. So when, when we're looking at the different income streams, it's writing opportunities. So, typically when we're speaking with journalists, they've got five different clients that they're writing for us. So we want to be able to, signal to different people that that journalist is open to. Right. So connecting with them, writing opportunities is one.

00:06:43:17 - 00:07:06:10

Brett

The other thing that we see emerging really, really prominently is Substack right now. So we want to be able to connect, journalists with more Substack subscribers and amplify the visibility for that work. And then we'll see, other stuff like consultations, where it's not a, basically you're you're booking 30 minutes to learn about how to pitch better and PR and stuff like that.

00:07:06:10 - 00:07:31:27

Brett

So, you'll be able to, to schedule consultation hours. If a journalist has affiliate relationships where they're recommending tools, pretty frequently, they'll be able to list that on their profile. And any time someone makes a purchase from that recommendation, journalist will be able to keep 100% of that affiliate revenue. So things like that, that, that just are extensions of what the journalist is already doing.

00:07:32:00 - 00:07:50:07

Jason

So when you, when you flagged them or tagged them as open to write on the platform, that means they're open to. Right, not for other media outlets, but also for the corporations and the PR, companies maybe that are participating in, Haro platform.

00:07:50:09 - 00:08:01:25

Brett

Yeah, absolutely. So for journalists, it's like writing about cybersecurity and your cybersecurity security company. That's a great writer to potentially bring on board and produce some, some content.

00:08:01:27 - 00:08:16:14

Jason

Okay. Yeah. Interesting. Okay. And do you have any data that tells you, you know, how many journalists are in this category either whether it's on your platform or just otherwise, like, you know, how how prominent and common is this practice?

00:08:16:16 - 00:08:36:29

Brett

Well, there's been 75,000 plus journalists who have used Haro. So the quantity of profiles that we're going to launch with is going to be fairly large. And then in terms of the folks who are open to. Right, and being able to connect with, you know, different, different companies to write blog posts, I think that that's going to be determined.

00:08:37:06 - 00:08:52:03

Brett

It's going to be all, you know, being able to, have have it be fully customized and claimable. So we're not just going to turn on features like journalists actually have to clean their profile, and then they could drag and drop and design that profile however they like.

00:08:52:05 - 00:08:56:29

Jason

Okay. And to clarify, are, is this are these profiles active now or is that in the roadmap.

00:08:57:02 - 00:09:03:19

Brett

That's this is on the roadmap. This is something that we're going to be launching with before 2025 NS okay okay.

00:09:03:19 - 00:09:16:14

Jason

Perfect. Great. And then tell me about we my notes here say about, reducing, pitch friction and improve match quality. You talk about that for a minute.

00:09:16:16 - 00:09:37:02

Brett

Yeah. So I think the thing with, with Haro is it's a three times a day email newsletter where journalists put in a request. That request goes in with a group of other requests and is sent via email. And then sources can get in touch directly with the journalist, to make their pitch. And so how do you know what to include in your pitch?

00:09:37:02 - 00:09:56:00

Brett

And so we've got data that essentially signals what a journalist responds to. And then making those pitch guidelines visible for, corporate communications teams, PR professionals, do yourself small business owners so that that pitch is going to be, met with a favorable response from that journalist.

00:09:56:02 - 00:10:18:11

Jason

Got it, got it. You're reminding me, years ago, I was talking to a mortgage company and their chief marketing officer, a VP. I forgot the exact title. Maybe marketing director was telling me that he scrolls through the, you know, Haro, summaries while he's shaving and brushing his teeth each morning, and I said, man, you need a PR firm because that's not the way to live life.

00:10:18:13 - 00:10:36:16

Jason

You know, and so the way we do it here is we have one person on our team who's in charge of looking at those, those emails or those notifications the second they come out and then distributing to the experts internally who are managing those accounts or whatever, just for the highest and best use of our account team.

00:10:36:16 - 00:10:56:20

Jason

Right. And our agency. So, you know, it didn't make any sense for a marketing person who really doesn't know anything about PR, which is which is fine. You know, to be the one reviewing those and looking for the opportunities and then trying to do their own pitching to them, especially if the only time they can squeeze them in is, you know, other shaving and brushing their teeth and getting ready for the day.

00:10:56:22 - 00:11:13:23

Brett

Yeah, absolutely. I think that, you know, it's definitely evolved quite a bit in terms of getting that three times a day email and then being able to set alerts to it. And then now we're seeing a lot of home baked and, hard wired solutions to monitor those emails, a little bit more effectively.

00:11:13:26 - 00:11:33:11

Jason

Yeah. There's somebody that, was going to have is a guest on the show who had done some AI automation for hero. But then it disappeared. And so I just kind of canceled the, you know, the, the, the segment because I didn't think it naturally made sense. But, you know, I'm not sure what he's doing now, but, yeah, there are definitely, it's interesting.

00:11:33:11 - 00:12:00:02

Jason

I didn't realize that there were companies who had, you know, attach themself or latch themselves to the, hero. Hero product to be able to offer, you know, additional services beyond the media pitching. Right. So I've seen search optimization firms offer that as a service to help them get, you know, quoted in backlinks. And then I've seen, you know, people make it so there's, you know, filters and tools and I, suggested responses and things like that.

00:12:00:06 - 00:12:06:02

Jason

How do you feel about that? Is that something you're comfortable with or you feel like that kind of violates what you want people doing?

00:12:06:05 - 00:12:27:24

Brett

Our goal at the end of the day is connect is to connect journalists with great sources for stories. Sure. And however that gets done. Great. And so it's it's a challenge for us when we see that, that, hey, this is, a weakness maybe that exists on the platform. If there's an if there's a need for another service to emerge, then that's a signal for us to see if that's something that we want to address.

00:12:27:27 - 00:12:45:10

Jason

Yeah, I like that. So feel free to, you know, kind of latch on or hitch on a plug in and add on or whatever, but that doesn't guarantee that you're not going to, you know, eliminate them and, by doing it yourself or integrate it into your own platform. And over the years, we've seen Google and other, you know, kind of technology come in and be like, hey, that's a good idea.

00:12:45:10 - 00:12:49:01

Jason

We're going to do that too. You know, there's not nothing that you're violating, right?

00:12:49:03 - 00:13:14:02

Brett

Yeah, exactly. So, you know, it's stuff like we'll see. One of the coolest things I think that exists is being able to use like a knowledge base. So content that if someone's created or looking at experiences that, that source has had and then being able to use that as an enhanced alert system so that when there's an opportunity that goes in, you're alerted to that opportunity that's beyond just the term.

00:13:14:02 - 00:13:26:29

Brett

Like cybersecurity. Maybe you've got some certain experience, that really connects you to a particular opportunity. I think that's really the smart matching mechanism that we're seeing today.

00:13:27:02 - 00:13:46:27

Jason

Yeah, I like that a lot. And, you know, I know there's other platforms out there and ones that I appreciate are the ones that you can go into and see your past responses in case there was something you said you or your client said, really smart for another topic or whatever. And, you know, it's been many years since I've used, you know, hero itself.

00:13:46:27 - 00:14:10:22

Jason

But when I did, it was always helpful to kind of be like, wait, I basically a pitch this same kind of concept before, let me see if I can find it, go back, tweak it, of course, improve it, make it even better for what this journalist is asking. But 80% of that's already been put together, and I certainly don't want my team, to go back to our clients and start over when we've got, you know, a bulk of that content already ready to go.

00:14:10:24 - 00:14:33:04

Brett

Yeah. I think that we're in this human in the loop PR era and, and and when you look at what that means, it's really being able to say, hey, how do how do we use AI to essentially get something to, third base? And how do you, as a PR professional, be able to take it across the finish line and make it really usable for, for a journalist?

00:14:33:06 - 00:14:54:22

Brett

So I think that, you know, what we're seeing with reporters and journalists is two camps. One is, you know, I don't want anything to do with AI. And then others who are like, hey, I don't care if this is written by AI because I just need to get connected with a source. Yeah. And if they can get connected with the right source, then they're going to do their job and follow up and, you know, be able to get that information for their story.

00:14:54:22 - 00:15:13:00

Brett

So it's been a pretty interesting, stance that we've been taken as a platform to just try to be neutral and equip people with the tools that allow you to use AI to get the right opportunities. And then for journalists to be able to be transparent about whether or not something was or was not written by a.

00:15:13:02 - 00:15:35:14

Jason

Yeah. And I think the query itself from the journalists could simply say very clearly, do not reply with AI generated responses or I will not consider them or I'm forbidden from considering them or whatever. But I mean, at the end of the day, you know, if this was 1970 or 80, you know, and somebody said, oh, I prefer to write my stories by hand instead of using, you know, a word processor or whatever it might be.

00:15:35:20 - 00:15:53:00

Jason

People would just laugh at them, you know? And that's kind of how I feel about AI. There's there's a role for it and, you know, but, you know, resisting or saying, I'm not going to use it because I don't think it's ethical, wise, useful. Whatever you want to say is kind of like, you know, are you still, you know, it's like, what'd you do in the fax machine came out, you know, still.

00:15:53:02 - 00:16:08:17

Jason

So put stuff in the mail when it need to be faxed or, you know, did you use Fedex for something that just a one page fax or something. So I'm dating myself here with these analogies, but I can just, you know, I equate it to, you know, people say, man, PR has really changed in the last ten, 20, 30 years.

00:16:08:17 - 00:16:32:19

Jason

I like it really hasn't changed. We just have more tools, more vulnerabilities, higher expectations. But the practice of PR itself, in my opinion, is identical. Right? You got to have good strategy, good communication skills. You might have a lot more tools at your fingertips, but misuse of those tools can just amplify, you know, your, you know, lack of, you know, good communication and sophistication.

00:16:32:21 - 00:16:35:27

Jason

So you do have to be very careful and be on word all the time.

00:16:35:29 - 00:16:48:07

Brett

Yeah, absolutely. I think the role that AI has is really monitoring. It's it's being able to monitor so much different information and do that effectively. So that's just making the job of a PR professional that much easier.

00:16:48:07 - 00:16:57:15

Jason

This episode is brought to you by Audible. Enjoy 30 days free of Audible Premium Plus by going to ontopofpr.com/audible.

00:16:57:15 - 00:17:22:04

Announcer

You're listening to On Top of PR with your host, Jason Mudd. Jason is a trusted advisor to some of America's most admired and fastest growing brands. He is the managing partner at Axia Public Relations, a PR agency that guides news, social and web strategies for national companies. And now, back to the show.

00:17:22:04 - 00:17:40:29

Jason

So I want to rewind to a couple of things. So first of all you I asked you earlier about, you know, Horo and you mentioned, you know, your primary focus is, is making the job of journalists easier. And I love that's where you landed. Because at the end of the day, you know, it's legacy wise, it's been a great platform, right?

00:17:40:29 - 00:18:05:18

Jason

Connecting experts directly to journalists and journalists, directly to the experts they need when they need it, you know, kind of on demand. And Peter, certainly, you know, gets all the credit for coming up with that, certainly gets the credit for innovating it and, using his network to build it very quickly. And so to that end, I guess, my first question is, you know, you lead with journalist, is that intentional?

00:18:05:18 - 00:18:15:17

Jason

And, and regardless what percentage of your focus is towards journalists versus sources and how do you manage that? User experience for both parties?

00:18:15:19 - 00:18:20:02

Brett

Yeah, I think it's in the name it's help a reporter out.

00:18:20:02 - 00:18:21:05

Jason

Right, right.

00:18:21:08 - 00:18:45:20

Brett

We got have I mean and then if you look at the business model of Haro, it's 100% newsletter ad supported. And so, that gives us a license to be pretty strict when it comes to sources who may or may not be misusing the system. And then that, equates to better quality for the journalist. So we've got to be able to take a stand, and, and pick a side to be supportive of and with help reporter out.

00:18:45:20 - 00:19:08:27

Brett

It's it's very much majority on, on journalists and reporters that said, we still have to be cognizant of sources because obviously that's the connection that that needs to happen. So, but if we were to pick a side and I think that's the difference of any other tool that's in the space is it's it's for reporters. And the business model is not dependent on subscriptions from, PR professionals.

00:19:08:29 - 00:19:30:09

Jason

For sure. At the end of the day, right. The cart before the horse. Right. You got to please, if you don't have journalists, then sources don't come. If you don't have sources, journalists don't come. You got to make both audiences happy. I think the more sophisticated audience, broadly speaking, is going to be journalists, right? They have certain expectations and criteria, and they're probably a little more easier, easier to offend and lose.

00:19:30:09 - 00:19:50:26

Jason

Right. And, meanwhile, what I've loved about, horror over the years, it's the great equalizer, right? It has put journalists directly in touch with, with experts. So whether those experts want to or can afford PR representation, they now have kind of a low barrier to entry, almost grassroots, organic. I'm not sure the right word to describe it.

00:19:50:29 - 00:20:09:01

Jason

Connectivity to journalists to see exactly what they're looking for and even what I like is take a few at bats themselves so they can see that this isn't just easy and instant and, you know that, they will get ghosted, you know, they will. Their pitch might get ignored and things like that. And and if they don't hit that deadline.

00:20:09:02 - 00:20:19:23

Jason

I don't know about your current platform, but in the past, I know if you don't hit that deadline, you're not responding to them at all unless you ask them for more time and got their direct contact information and things like that.

00:20:19:25 - 00:20:41:06

Brett

Yeah, I think that you're hitting on some some good points there in terms of there's benefit because everyone is an expert in something and Haro very much democratizes that access to to earn media. And at the same time, it's not an easy game. So you can go out and experience it and know how time intensive it may be, how low of a hit rate you might experience.

00:20:41:08 - 00:20:44:15

Brett

And so I think it's a win win for everyone who's involved.

00:20:44:15 - 00:21:03:11

Jason

I totally agree with you. No doubt. Okay. So this just naturally leads me to the next thing where, you know, or thinking about, you know, better pitches, fewer blasts. You know, the example I like to use is in PR, like Major League Baseball, if you're batting average is over 300, you're a Hall of Famer.

00:21:03:18 - 00:21:21:12

Jason

If you're in PR and you're batting average is over 300, you're probably a Hall of Famer now. It hasn't stopped somebody from a cynic or somebody who thinks they're cute and tell me, well, that just means then you need to send out more pitches. And I'm like, no. Do you see a Hall of Fame? You know, batter swinging at more pitches to get a higher batting average and get on base more often?

00:21:21:12 - 00:21:29:18

Jason

You don't. Right. And so I know we want to talk about this. So I'm just taking it up right now. Better pitches fewer blasts. Talk to me about how that works.

00:21:29:21 - 00:21:36:07

Brett

Yeah I think I think you're spot on. And, great to know that you're a baseball fan. So I think that, you know,

00:21:36:07 - 00:21:48:22

Brett

generally speaking, when when sources come to us and they're like, what do I do here? And how do I how do I be helpful? I think it's really in the Hero acronym. It's be helpful, be authentic, be relevant, and be on time.

00:21:48:24 - 00:22:06:12

Brett

Being being helpful is basically just saying, hey, if I were in the shoes of this journalist, if this is a helpful pitch, be authentic is just don't use 100% AI and add your own human expertise to things. Be relevant. Make sure that you have the credentials and be on time as journalists are on deadline, and they need to get connected with the source quickly.

00:22:06:12 - 00:22:11:20

Brett

So the faster that you can respond to that journalist and be helpful, the better success that you'll have.

00:22:13:02 - 00:22:30:20

Jason

Yeah, I completely agree. And I don't know about your platform, but in the past, when it was when it was, you know, ran by Peter, I always found that sending a follow up email within that deadline was also very helpful too. So you might have been first, and I believe it's important to be first, or early.

00:22:30:25 - 00:22:50:04

Jason

And then the deadline might sit for a little bit longer. I've always found it's good to just say, hey, I just want to make sure you got my pitch, make myself available if you have any questions. And here's the best way to reach me if you do. And that way, in the event, the deadline closes and you can't reply back to them anymore, you know, it's just kind of a one more kind of effort out there.

00:22:50:07 - 00:22:52:22

Jason

That that I always found to be very helpful.

00:22:52:25 - 00:22:57:01

Brett

It's a good hack. It's a good tip. You know, the inbox is a busy place.

00:22:57:03 - 00:23:09:06

Jason

Yep, yep. For sure. For sure. All right, so what I want to go back to for just a minute. So you said you've got 700 or 75,000 users. Is that journalist is that sources? Is that a combination?

00:23:09:13 - 00:23:13:00

Brett

That's the number of journalists who who have used Haro,

00:23:13:03 - 00:23:15:16

Jason

That are currently enrolled or that have used it historically.

00:23:15:20 - 00:23:16:12

Brett

Historically.

00:23:16:18 - 00:23:38:00

Jason

Okay, yeah. So it's a pretty big, ecosystem and very well known brand. And again, credit to Peter for building that. Speaking of Peter, how does it feel to be kind of, I mean, he's he started his own version once they closed down. Haro, you acquired the assets to it in the brand, and if can can continue to build it.

00:23:38:00 - 00:23:46:18

Jason

But, do you have a relationship with Peter? Have you talked to him? I mean, you know, this is his baby now. You own it, and he's out there kind of, doing something similar.

00:23:46:21 - 00:23:59:29

Brett

Yeah. I mean, when we acquired it, I thought it was only right to bring it to his attention and then to present him with an opportunity and and, you know, it didn't work out. So we we revived it, and we've turned the page and and moved on.

00:24:00:04 - 00:24:15:20

Jason

Cool. Yeah. He's been a guest on the show. He's been a friend of our agency for many years. And, you know, I love what he's done. And credit to him for coming up with this concept. And, you know, now there's a handful of different platforms that you can do this on. And I'm just a big believer that competition is good for everybody.

00:24:15:22 - 00:24:36:25

Jason

And, and raises the bar. So, you know, speaking of kind of, you know, there is there is a little bit of competition for this when originally there was none. And when there's something good that somebody, innovates and disrupts the marketplace with, others come to the market as well. So, you know, where where do you see yourself really standing out from everything from the other options that are out there?

00:24:36:25 - 00:24:43:14

Jason

And what are you planning on doing maybe that they're not doing yet, or because I'm seeing a lot of them diversify into different areas.

00:24:43:17 - 00:25:00:20

Brett

Yeah. I think that the reason why Haro works is because it's such a large, helpful network. So if you if you have sources and you have sources who are willing to connect journalists with other sources, it works. And so Haro doesn't have any friction. It's the email based. You don't have to sign up an order to submit to journalists.

00:25:00:20 - 00:25:14:26

Brett

And and that's why it's working today. So I think that at the end of the day, it's where journalists are going to have success and finding sources. And Haro seems to be, you know, in six months since its revival, picking right up where I left off.

00:25:14:26 - 00:25:29:19

Brett

it's funny because, you know, it's been back for six months and people still think it's dead. And then the people who who, you know, never knew it was dead, as I've always just assume it's been around. So it's been eventful, you know, and it's pretty easy to to get started and get resubscribe to.

00:25:29:21 - 00:25:33:07

Jason

So tell me, yeah, it is easy to get resubscribe. So how does somebody do that.

00:25:33:09 - 00:25:40:16

Brett

Go to help reporter.com enter your email address and you'll get three emails a day with summary of requests from journalists.

00:25:40:18 - 00:25:51:29

Jason

Okay. Good. Yeah. And if this is the first time someone's ever heard of Haro before, what what would what kind of advice would you give them beyond, what I thought was really cool, earlier, helpful, authentic, relevant, and on time.

00:25:52:01 - 00:26:13:00

Brett

I think that's that's it. You know, I would also maybe to be consistent, figure out a good monitoring system and. Yeah, for that I would recommend feature.com because we, featured owns and operates Haro. So you could use feature to set an alert and get early access to Haro queries as well. So that's a good, good hack and good way to stay consistent.

00:26:13:02 - 00:26:32:14

Jason

Okay. I like that a lot. I did and the deal, did you have access to all past users that you could send an email to and let them know that it's back? And I assume you did that if you did, we did. Okay. Perfect. Yeah, yeah, one time or multiple times. I feel like that's something you need to make sure people know multiple times.

00:26:32:18 - 00:26:48:00

Jason

Yeah. Cool. Okay, good good good. I think I remember getting it multiple times because I sent it to the person on our team that's in charge of that. Boy, are we are we connected here? Because this is important, you know. And she assured me she is. So she's on top of it. And I love that. I think that's the for us, that's the best practice.

00:26:48:00 - 00:27:02:14

Jason

Instead of having, you know, three, 4 or 5, eight people look at it every day or every email. We've got kind of a coverage system in place. I don't know if that's helpful to our audience, which is why I'm sharing it. But years ago, you know, we used to split it up, you know, in shifts.

00:27:02:14 - 00:27:21:13

Jason

So, you know, Becca would do the morning shift, and Katie would do the afternoon, and somebody else would do the evening blast kind of thing. Then we start splitting up by the day, and now we just have one person like, that's a big part of her role. And for some reason, if she's, you know, out of the out for PTO or vacation, we have a sub jump in to monitor it kind of thing.

00:27:21:13 - 00:27:24:15

Jason

So that's our model, I don't know, have you heard anything creative? But.

00:27:24:18 - 00:27:38:24

Brett

I mean, you're on it. This is that. That's great. I think, you know, just goes back again to to monitoring and and if that's, that's a human based system, if it's a human and AI system, just don't make it 100% AI.

00:27:38:27 - 00:27:57:18

Jason

Right? Right. Yeah. And I, you know, back in the day, we just use message rules that would look for certain terms and things like that. I don't know, we do today, to be honest, I'm grateful to not have to be the one in the trenches doing that. But, the last thing I know we wanted to hit on today was talking about measurement shift from vanity placements to expert authority.

00:27:57:20 - 00:28:15:16

Jason

And, I know you've got some thoughts on that. We love to talk about measurement. We love to talk about avoiding vanity and focus on, you know what? What moves the needle, for the company and ultimately, you know, thought leadership and expertise sharing. So, tell me more about what you what you have in mind there.

00:28:15:23 - 00:28:35:27

Brett

Yeah, I think that model mentions is, the the new metric, the the thing that we hear from people pretty frequently is that they want to be featured in LMS. How do you raise your AI visibility? And so, I think that there's a lot of platforms that have have emerged and have done a great job of measuring that AI visibility.

00:28:35:27 - 00:29:02:15

Brett

So scale post AI is probably my favorite, profound seems to be the leader in the space. There's another one that I'm impressed with their team called Chat Ranked AI. There's a lot of different tools that measure AI visibility. And then I also came out with, you know, their own, tool as well. And so I think model mentions is a is a very interesting metric to start to, measure and try to take action on.

00:29:02:17 - 00:29:15:16

Brett

And I think that media mentions helps with model mentions. And so platforms like Haro are a great way to help boost up, those, those media mentions so that your model mentions can start to go up as well.

00:29:15:18 - 00:29:50:01

Jason

Yeah, I love that. And yes, everybody is asking about LMS and how do we optimize. And you know, we're calling it AI relations. Just like there's investor relations. Community relations, public relations, media relations. And you know, I know other people are calling it generative engine optimization, answer engine optimization and other things. But at the end of the day, you know, this is the this is the new, in our industry, you know, grateful that 90, 96% of, I citations come from PR content, which, you know, muck Rock had a big report on that.

00:29:50:03 - 00:30:09:20

Jason

And I think that's great for our profession, of course. And, and creating synergies. But there's more to do to that than just organic earned media coverage, which I think it's important for people to understand. You got to have structured data. You know, you've got to make sure that, you know, you're doing things, kind of holistically in 360 degrees to make this really work.

00:30:09:20 - 00:30:32:08

Jason

Well, so, as a as for the convenience of our audience, as always, we will put together an episode notes. And in the episode notes, we'll put links to these different resources that you've shared and recommended, as well as a link to get connected with you on LinkedIn and to get registered with, help a reporter out. Brett, speaking of, LinkedIn, that is that the best way for people to connect with you?

00:30:32:10 - 00:30:36:06

Brett

Yeah. Or just, via email. Brett@feature.com.

00:30:36:08 - 00:30:40:18

Jason

Perfect. Excellent. Any closing thoughts you want to share with our audience?

00:30:40:20 - 00:30:56:12

Brett

You know, I would say thanks for having me on the show. I would also say that it's it's, an incredible opportunity that we have to make Haro helpful. And so, if anyone has any recommendations or ways that we can improve lawyers.

00:30:56:15 - 00:31:15:09

Jason

Yeah. I appreciate you sharing that. We're glad to have you here, too. And honestly, you know, I think being helpful as a business strategy is incredibly undervalued. But I like to buy from people who have been helpful to me. And, you know, I always tell people that, you know, if you can help somebody else when they need it, they'll remember it and try to refer you.

00:31:15:09 - 00:31:31:11

Jason

Because people like to do business with people they know, like and trust. I think we forget about that sometimes. And perhaps especially in business. But, you know, what comes around, goes around, and, I really think that, you know, just being helpful and friendly and nice to people goes a long way.

00:31:31:13 - 00:31:35:11

Brett

Not just a message for the holidays. It's it's 12 months a year.

00:31:35:14 - 00:31:57:05

Jason

That's right. And for the record, we are recording this on November 10th, 2025. And things can change at a blink of an eye. So, we'll just make sure that we've documented that here. But if there's anything else that I can do to be helpful to you, let me know. But we appreciate you coming on this episode, sharing your smarts and insights, helping, help a reporter out become even more helpful to that community.

00:31:57:08 - 00:32:15:23

Jason

And, you know, one of the examples I recently shared with a conference I was speaking is, you know, somebody asked me, what's one of the smartest things you've seen a client do over the years? And there's several but one that stood out for me. And I think you'll appreciate this is why I'm bringing it up. This particular client was always willing to help a reporter, no matter what they were writing about.

00:32:15:23 - 00:32:34:23

Jason

So her background was finance. She got moved around, you know, from, from a CPA to a, chief marketing officer. But her rule of thumb was, anytime a reporter need help understanding something financial and I could help them, I would do it. Even if they didn't cover my sector, cover my company, or whatever the case may be.

00:32:34:25 - 00:32:48:10

Jason

And I can tell you, to this day, it's still paying dividends for her, you know, because she invested in those relationships, not looking for anything in return. When she's got a pitch. It's so much easier to connect her with journalist because they like or trust her and want to do business with her.

00:32:48:13 - 00:33:00:23

Brett

I think it's a great strategy is and especially today, journalists need a lot of help and there's a lot of ways to be helpful. So, I'd be interested in investing in the long term if I was in PR.

00:33:00:25 - 00:33:18:23

Jason

Yeah, 100%. All right, Brett, thank you for another great episode. And, with that, this is, been another episode of On Top of PR. As always, we look forward to helping you stay on top of PR. If you found this episode valuable, please take a minute and share it with a friend or colleague who you think would benefit from it.

00:33:18:25 - 00:33:36:29

Jason

Always the best way to do that is on top of Procom. We have all of our episodes listed there, both video and audio versions, as well as episode notes. Where you can link, see and link to the content and websites and other tools that we mentioned here. So with that, I want to say thanks to Brett and Harrow.

00:33:36:29 - 00:33:56:15

Jason

Harrow for, for coming back and, for being here to help, journalists make their jobs a lot easier. Journalism is a great profession, and one that really needs as much help as we can give it. And whatever time we can save them by connecting them with the best experts would be great. If you found this episode valuable again, please share it with a friend or colleague.

00:33:56:18 - 00:33:59:09

Jason

And if you'd like, please leave us a review. We really appreciate that, too. With that, Jason Mudd from Axi Public Relations signing off. I hope something great happens to you today.

00:33:59:09 - 00:34:55:01

Announcer

This has been On Top of PR with Jason Mudd presented by ReviewMaxer. Be sure to subscribe so you don't miss an episode and check out past episodes at ontopofpr.com.