In this episode, Carly Roszkowski joins host Jason Mudd to discuss ageism in the workplace, how it affects job seekers over 50, hiring bias, and strategies for multigenerational teams.
Tune in to learn more!
Watch the episode here:
Meet our guest:
Our guest on this episode is Carly Roszkowski, vice president of financial resilience at AARP. She leads strategy and outcomes within AARP’s Work and Jobs and Financial Resilience initiatives, helping individuals over 50 strengthen their competitiveness in the labor market and access meaningful employment opportunities. Carly also works to eliminate age discrimination and promote inclusive hiring practices across organizations.
5 things you’ll learn during the full episode:
- How ageism in the workplace impacts job seekers and employees over 50 years old
- The biggest challenges experienced professionals face when seeking new opportunities
- How department leaders can effectively support and manage multigenerational teams
- Best practices hiring managers can use to better support experienced talent
- Practical ways employees and coworkers can help create a safe, inclusive, and high-performing workplace
Listen to the episode here:
Quotables
- “AARP is fighting every day to end age discrimination in the workplace and educate consumers, knowing their rights, as well as educating employers on the value that older workers bring to an organization.” — Carly Roszkowski
- “Networking and knowing someone is still a really great way to start your job search.” — Carly Roszkowski
- “60% of workers 50 and older have said that they would love to learn new skills for their job or on the job.” — Carly Roszkowski
- “Research shows that there's increased innovation, increased creativity, better problem solving when you have a mix of ages, mix of different backgrounds, or from different points of view.” — Carly Roszkowski
- “Mirror the language; reflect the terminology that you see in the job description in your application.” — Jason Mudd
If you enjoyed this episode, please take a moment to share it with a colleague or friend. You may also support us through Buy Me a Coffee or by leaving us a quick podcast review.
Resources
Guest’s contact info and resources:
- Carly Roszkowski on LinkedIn
- AARP website
- AARP Works and Jobs Resources
- AARP Employer Resource Center
- Older Workers are Building Tech Skills Research
Additional Resources:
- How to calculate the true cost of hiring an employee
- Listen to more episodes of the On Top of PR with Jason Mudd podcast.
- Find out more about Axia Public Relations.
If you like this episode, you're going to love this:
- Courageous conversations about diversity, equity, and inclusion
- Shattering the Six Gender Bias Barriers Still Holding Women Back at Work
- How to boost HR effectiveness
Recorded: December 10, 2025
.About your host Jason Mudd
Jason Mudd is a nationally recognized public relations expert featured by CNN, Entrepreneur, Forbes, NPR, The New York Times, PRWeek, and The Wall Street Journal.
Named North America’s top PR leader by the World Communication Forum, he serves as Partner of Axia Public Relations — recognized by Forbes as one of America’s Best PR Agencies.
Jason has advised some of the country’s most admired and fastest-growing companies, leading campaigns for iconic brands including American Airlines, Budweiser, Dave & Buster’s, GE, H&R Block, Hilton, HP, Miller Lite, New York Life, Pizza Hut, Southern Comfort, and Verizon.
He’s also a professional public speaker, accredited PR practitioner, published author, entrepreneur, and host of On Top of PR with Jason Mudd — a podcast ranked among the top 2.5% globally by Listen Notes and a top 100 marketing podcast on Apple Podcasts. His guests have included leaders from Disney, Microsoft, Southwest Airlines, and Wells Fargo. Learn more about Jason at https://www.axiapr.com/team/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
00;00;00;07 - 00;00;07;05
Carly
in 2018 alone, ageism cost the US economy about $850 billion.
00;00;07;10 - 00;00;07;23
Jason
Wow.
00;00;07;28 - 00;00;24;21
Carly
And if nothing changes or nothing's done, that number could increase and ballooned to over $4 trillion by 2050. And what I think people don't realize is that people over 50 contribute more than $8 trillion to the economy each year.
00;00;24;24 - 00;00;34;06
Announcer
Welcome to On Top of PR with Jason Mudd.
00;00;34;09 - 00;00;46;28
Jason
Hello and welcome to on top of PR, I'm your host, Jason Mudd with Axia Public Relations. I'm really glad you tuned into today's episode where we're talking about ageism in the workplace, and I am joined by an expert from AARP to talk about this exact topic.
00;00;47;05 - 00;01;18;09
Jason
I'm so excited to make this happen. It feels like a timely topic in the current employment environment, and we want to make sure that you know more about the importance of eliminating ageism in your workplace. So with that, I want to welcome to the show our special guest, Carly Roz Kowski. Carly serves as AARP Vice President of Financial Resilience Programing, where she oversees strategy and outcomes across the organization's financial resilience and Work and Jobs initiative.
00;01;18;15 - 00;01;41;29
Jason
In her role, she supports people over 50 years old in achieving their employment opportunities that they want by strengthening their competitiveness in the workforce, expanding access to meaningful work options and championing efforts that reduce age discrimination. Carly, I'm so glad you're here. Welcome to On top of PR.
00;01;42;01 - 00;01;45;13
Carly
Thanks so much for having me. I'm thrilled to be here, too.
00;01;45;15 - 00;02;25;00
Jason
Yeah. So, as we were talking before we hit record, I am going to hit the big five. Oh, next quarter. So probably right around the time this episode goes live, we're recording it in mid December 2025, and my birthday is in April of 2026. So, what I'm seeing, Carly, is a lot of my colleagues who are looking for work right now are telling me it's hard out there, now that they've, you know, kind of our more senior practitioners and, you know, they've kind of asked me for help and advice and, you know, I'm supporting them as best as I'm able, but it seemed like an interesting topic.
00;02;25;00 - 00;02;56;26
Jason
And then, I'm hearing from more and more people my age that this is becoming a challenge for them. So I wanted to invite your, reputable organization to come on and help our audience stay on top of PR, by looking at their own organization with the critical lens, to encourage and lead through these potential challenges in the workplace, and then also to help those individuals who are in the employment opportunity are looking for employment opportunities that might be feeling impacted in this way or are being impacted this way.
00;02;57;03 - 00;03;02;14
Jason
And so, Carly, in fairness, is this too much to tackle in one conversation?
00;03;02;17 - 00;03;18;13
Carly
Well, there's a lot we can talk about today, and there's a lot of resources and education that we have for 50 plus job seekers or those looking to change careers. But it's got to be an ongoing conversation, both with job seekers as well as employers.
00;03;18;16 - 00;03;43;06
Jason
Yes, I completely agree. This won't be a one and done conversation, but hopefully we can have some sort of impact, on our audience. And regardless of you know, where the conversation goes, our hope is to help them, you know, as leaders, as job seekers, as colleagues, in the workplace, elevate, and, and improve, the employment experiences for everybody.
00;03;43;08 - 00;03;44;11
Carly
Yes, I hope so, too.
00;03;44;15 - 00;03;55;22
Jason
Yeah. Lovely. Lovely I appreciate that. So our topic is ageism in the workplace. Let's just jump right in to how it affects seekers and employees who are over 50 years old.
00;03;55;25 - 00;04;25;18
Carly
Yeah. So our research at AARP shows that people 50 and older, 64% are saying they've seen or experienced age discrimination in the workplace, which is just super prevalent and unfortunate. And we see it even higher percentages for black workers 50 and older and women 50 and older. And women tend to experience age discrimination early on in their career, as well as later in their career.
00;04;25;18 - 00;04;44;01
Carly
So more of like a U-shaped curve, unfortunately. And so AARP is fighting every day, to end age discrimination in the workplace and educate consumers, knowing their rights, as well as educating employers on the value, that older workers bring to an organization.
00;04;44;03 - 00;05;16;14
Jason
Right? For sure. So it's interesting you mentioned that because I don't think I'll be the first person to tell you this. And for our audience, as we were talking before, you've worked in, you know, marketing for several years. So you're very experienced in this space. But, you know, in the PR business and in the marketing business, I mean, it tends to be a profession that is mostly female dominated and certainly, you know, a lot of, young people begin their careers there and some stick around and some change careers or do something completely different.
00;05;16;14 - 00;05;38;24
Jason
So it's interesting you mentioned the U-shaped curve. And so I definitely want to explore that a little bit more. But let's let's start with what I think, you know, sounds like a simple question, but it's probably not a simple answer, which is, you know, how do you know when you are experienced a experiencing ageism in the workplace or especially just during an interview?
00;05;38;24 - 00;05;58;06
Jason
Right. So maybe you're applying or you're interviewing and I wonder if, you know, it's one of those things like, you know, what is it? There's several things of life. They say, well, it's hard to explain, but when it happens, you know, it's happening to you. But also I think that, you know, that perhaps it can be it can be a real or perceived issue.
00;05;58;10 - 00;06;16;29
Jason
And I'm hoping we can tap into tips and recommendations, regardless of if it's real or perceived, how to position yourself, and how to keep, you know, an open, positive mind about it versus either thinking about it subconsciously or even bringing it up, which then could make it an issue that perhaps wasn't even an issue to begin with.
00;06;17;04 - 00;08;40;00
Jason
And maybe I'm dead wrong about that. And that's why we brought in you as the expert.
00;08;40;02 - 00;08;58;06
Jason
Carly. That's great. Thank you for your help with that. I think that makes a lot of sense. So I want to rewind to a couple of things. You mentioned, the year of graduation, on an employment application, for example. What would you prescribe is like a best practice of that because my I understand exactly what you're saying.
00;08;58;06 - 00;09;15;07
Jason
And as an employer, I've referenced the year of graduation and maybe in my head, just out of curiosity, tried to calculate maybe approximately, you know, an age or timeline of when they were in college and when they might have started their career to be able to have a better picture of how many years of employment experience they have.
00;09;15;09 - 00;09;34;00
Jason
But I also know employers will use that to go back later to do, any kind of verification that they might want to do. So is that something they should ask for at a later stage in the in the interview process, as they've identified, let's just say Sally is the person we want to make an offer to.
00;09;34;04 - 00;09;51;18
Jason
Maybe we've made her an offer contingent upon, verification of her credentials. And at that point, they can kind of ask her to complete, perhaps an additional, verification form. Would that be a best practice? I'm. I'm giving away advice here instead of just asking my expert.
00;09;51;20 - 00;10;16;14
Carly
Yes, Jason, that's great advice. We recommend that on your resume you want to list those important credentials, but you don't necessarily necessarily have to list the year that you graduated or the year you got that, credential. And when you are given a job offer, usually you have to disclose more information or give references or dates so that they can further verify.
00;10;16;14 - 00;10;18;03
Carly
So yes.
00;10;18;06 - 00;10;52;24
Jason
I like that a lot, because one thing we've been working on at our own agency is making it really easy for people to apply for a job, very easy for us to quickly identify, you know, whether there's somebody we want to proceed without asking to fill out a multi-page application of which, you know, we know very quickly that they don't meet the qualifications or the need for the for the opportunity because, I don't know about you, but, it's funny to me that people will apply for a job in PR because they're good with people or they're, you know, had a customer service job and they don't really understand.
00;10;52;24 - 00;11;13;23
Jason
You know, our profession is more driven by strategic communication than it is, you know, necessarily being good with people. Although fans of our podcast know, I say quite a bit, it's time we put the public into public relations. You know, it's kind of one of the cliches. I say quite a bit. But, you know, in the in the recent environment of employment, you have to move very quickly.
00;11;13;26 - 00;11;32;26
Jason
If you want to acquire the best talent. And so we've just looked at, I said, hey, I would hate for somebody and I would hate myself to fill out a very lengthy application, only to get a quick no. So we've kind of started doing like micro applications. And I think we I've already kind of picked up on a few things we could probably do to improve that.
00;11;32;29 - 00;11;33;01
Carly
Well,
00;11;33;01 - 00;11;58;25
Carly
Well, that certainly helps the job seeker as they're out there looking for opportunities. I'm curious with these micro applications, are you finding because it's so easy to apply and in the current workforce environment, are you getting way more candidates and you can sort of handle within your own staff and resources where you have to use technology to help sort of call down those candidates?
00;11;58;27 - 00;12;24;01
Jason
Yeah. Well, I mean, when we first adopted an ATS applicant tracking, solution, that was a huge help for us because then people weren't falling between the cracks. And now if somebody sends us an unsolicited resume, we basically kind of refuse it and say, hey, you know, thanks for sending this, but this is not the way to apply, because, you know, now we've got, you know, five contacts at our agency saying, hey, somebody wants a job and, you know, not sure what to do with it.
00;12;24;01 - 00;12;49;02
Jason
So we just simply refer everybody, you know, inbound phone calls, emails, etc. like this is the only place to apply. This is the only place we post jobs, you know, and that kind of thing to make it very transparent and very simple. To be honest, I don't think people realize when they're applying that, that it is an easier application online because they're still clicking apply, and I think they're still going through the process.
00;12;49;04 - 00;13;08;15
Jason
My hope was simply that they're not spending an hour or hours completing an application for a position that doesn't exist yet, or they're just not a good fit. So our hope is that they can fill it out and, you know, five, ten, 15 minutes. And that gives us a good summary. We keep them on file when they match to something we have an opening for.
00;13;08;21 - 00;13;12;03
Jason
Then we expand. You know, the conversation from there.
00;13;12;05 - 00;13;45;01
Carly
Well that's great. We do a lot of education to the older job seeker when applying for jobs to make sure that their resume does reflect some of the keywords found within the job descriptions. And sometimes they have the experience or the skills. They've just worded it differently. And with technology and these applicant tracking systems that most organizations are using, we're finding that when you include those exact keywords, you're more likely to sort of get past that applicant tracking system, to show that you are, in fact, a good candidate for the role.
00;13;45;01 - 00;14;13;01
Carly
But it's it's a good reminder, for job seekers with all the technology that's out there to, to make sure you're paying attention to the words within the job description and what these organizations are looking for and how your skills, translate into those jobs. We also look and talk a lot about job descriptions, both, to the employer and the organizations as well, because that can be another, red flag for age discrimination or bias.
00;14;13;03 - 00;14;42;10
Carly
When organizations use words like digital native or marketing ninja, high energy, those words automatically make older workers think that they might not be the best fit for those. For those positions, and so they might not even be be applying to those jobs that actually might be a great fit for their skills and expertise. And as you know, talking to marketers and PR executives, words matter and imagery matters.
00;14;42;10 - 00;14;57;15
Carly
So we talk a lot about making sure that the faces and the imagery that you have on your website portrays a range of ages. And so that, all different candidates could see themselves at your organization.
00;14;57;17 - 00;15;20;10
Jason
Yeah, that that's good advice. I've seen people post on LinkedIn, of all generations, but I would say I would argue, the geared a little bit more towards the younger, younger generations coming out on LinkedIn and just saying, look, I'm not a wizard. I'm not a ninja, I'm not a guru. Don't describe me as that. And, a job description or, you know, even a job title.
00;15;20;13 - 00;15;36;02
Jason
And I've seen many of them just say, if I see that, I just stop, you know, I'm like, this is just dumb. And I don't want to go work somewhere where they think I'm a social media wizard or a, you know, design wizard or something like that. And I think it's, you know, it depends on the culture of the company.
00;15;36;02 - 00;15;58;20
Jason
I think some companies that's, you know, just their culture in their way. But I also definitely can see where that turns off. Not only, you know, discourages, application from certain generations, but at the same time, I'm seeing, you know, the generation I think they're trying to appeal to looking at it and saying that it's kind of, you know, disrespectful or unprofessional in their view.
00;15;58;23 - 00;16;27;08
Carly
We have a great guide, and it's a resource for HR executives. And on the employer side, but it's it's say this not that, and it goes through those kind of, examples of and saying instead of saying digital native, you know, say something like ability to, you know, navigate a digital platform or digital tools, more sort of descriptive of, of what the job and the skills needed to, to do the job.
00;16;27;10 - 00;16;45;10
Jason
Well, we will definitely get a link to that from you so we can add it to the episode notes. At on top of PR, slash Carly. Roz. Russ. Kowski. Sorry. Orozco. Sky is that correct?
00;16;45;13 - 00;16;46;29
Carly
Rosie. Okay.
00;16;46;29 - 00;17;06;29
Jason
And yes. Yes, I'm reading from my phonetic spelling. Sorry, it's Roz z kayo Sky. And if you're watching this on YouTube or in video format, her name is right here on your screen. So that will make it even easier for you. But we will put a link to that in the episode notes so that, it's easily accessible.
00;17;07;01 - 00;17;36;02
Jason
And you can check that out because I know I want to look through that as well. And, make sure I'm sharing it with our team, so they can improve upon it. I want to rewind just a little bit. You mentioned something that has always been fascinating to me. I'm glad you brought it up. Which is, you know, using the right terms and terminology and keywords in your submission, your resume, your cover letter, your, online completion of the applicant tracking form or whatever it might be.
00;17;36;05 - 00;17;54;12
Jason
You know, we've done a lot of work in with staffing firms and, employment organizations over the years. And, you know, we've probably been talking about this for 20 years. And my point in bringing it up is that it's still incredibly important, and I'm still surprised how many people, you know, aren't taking advantage of thinking that through.
00;17;54;16 - 00;18;34;02
Jason
And in the era of AI, it's even more important if you know, like it or not, your resume has been, you know, crawled and indexed, for decades, and it's only being done more. And that's a unique opportunity. Carly, I think personally and I want to lean into your expertise. But, you know, I tell people, mirror the language, reflect the terminology that you see in the job description in your application, and think of additional keywords to insert, almost like you're a search engine optimization expert, or find someone to help you with that so that you come up in the right searches when they're looking for your candidacy.
00;18;34;04 - 00;18;38;16
Jason
Am I wrong? Do you have other thoughts? How do we take this and make it even better?
00;18;38;18 - 00;19;01;26
Carly
You were correct, Jason. We also talk a lot about networking. Now, for older job seekers, we tend to have larger networks. We've been in, the labor market for decades. And, we encourage older workers and job seekers to use that network. So if you're not on LinkedIn to make sure that you're on LinkedIn, but not just be on there.
00;19;01;28 - 00;19;25;27
Carly
To your point, making sure that your resume and experience is reflective of the the job descriptions or jobs that you're looking at and reflects those skills. Make sure you're listing skills. I know that if you list at least five skills, you're 17 times more likely to be seen by the recruiters on LinkedIn. So there's there's advantages to lift listing those skills within your, profile.
00;19;25;27 - 00;19;47;28
Carly
Make sure you have a picture in your profile. Make sure you're talking to everyone your neighbors, your former colleagues, your current colleagues, if it's appropriate, that you're in the market and looking for a new opportunity. Because networking and knowing someone, is still a really great way to start your job search.
00;19;48;00 - 00;20;08;18
Jason
Yeah, I mean, I, I think that's very smart. The more I know the about what somebody is looking to do or has been doing or, you know, whatever, just hearing from someone keeps them top of mind. And so I may not be thinking about somebody today until they reach out to me. And then tomorrow or yesterday I heard some that they would be a perfect fit for, so I'm a big fan of that.
00;20;08;18 - 00;20;13;04
Jason
And just keeping your network aware of, you know, what you're working on and trying to accomplish.
00;20;13;06 - 00;20;22;17
Jason
This episode is brought to you by Audible. Enjoy 30 days free of Audible Premium Plus by going to ontopofpr.com/audible.
00;20;22;19 - 00;20;46;24
Announcer
You're listening to On Top of PR with your host, Jason Mudd. Jason is a trusted advisor to some of America's most admired and fastest growing brands. He is the managing partner at Axia Public Relations, a PR agency that guides news, social and web strategies for national companies. And now, back to the show.
00;20;46;27 - 00;21;04;18
Jason
I also want to just go back a little bit, you were talking about, you know, I'm. I don't want to misquote you, but what came to mind when you were describing kind of common thoughts about different generations in the workplace, the one you didn't per se, mentioned by name, I don't think, but the one that comes top to mind for me is technology.
00;21;04;20 - 00;21;27;05
Jason
And, you know, at the end of the day, I'm a big believer that just because somebody knows how to operate technology and they're a technician with it doesn't mean that they're great at what that particular technology can do. And to eliminate any, any, you know, being vague about this, I'll just spell it out. You know, somebody might be really good at using InDesign or Photoshop.
00;21;27;05 - 00;21;52;12
Jason
From a technical standpoint, that doesn't necessarily mean that person is an artist. Right. And so I've been in this business long enough to see where maybe an art director did everything by hand and didn't use a computer, and then had to learn how to use a computer and then some, you know, younger generation person maybe comes up and suddenly they know how to do everything within the software, but they just are a technician with the software they really didn't have.
00;21;52;20 - 00;22;12;19
Jason
I think the the advantage of knowing how to do something by hand and having to go and my one of my first jobs was a darkroom technician. Right. And you learn certain things working with your hands in that way, that someone who's just clicking buttons will probably never fully appreciate and not necessarily have the same kind of.
00;22;12;21 - 00;22;36;19
Jason
Well, when that happens, here's how you do it. And could kind of engineer or reverse engineer the software to do something that they probably would have never thought of without that hands on experience. So I'm a big fan of having the variety of experience. But, you know, maybe there's somebody listening. I guess I'm saying who, whether it's imposter syndrome or reality that, you know, they're a little bit, concerned about their tech skills.
00;22;36;25 - 00;22;39;04
Jason
What advice would you give to them?
00;22;39;06 - 00;23;05;08
Carly
Sure. Well, there's a lot of misconceptions about older workers, and not being tech savvy is one of the biggest ones, for sure. And actually, we put out a new report from AARP on LinkedIn just yesterday that shows from 2022 to 2025, workers age 50 and older increased their share of LinkedIn learning sessions on technology topics from 19% to 27%.
00;23;05;15 - 00;23;06;02
Jason
Okay.
00;23;06;04 - 00;23;40;01
Carly
It also shows that the share of disruptive technology skills, such as cybersecurity or data science, listed within LinkedIn profiles, has grown for workers of all ages over the last five years, which makes sense, but it's grown significantly more for older workers, at 25%. Our research also shows that while there might be preconceived notions or stereotypes, that older workers are just sort of complacent and waiting to retire, that they actually want to keep learning new skills, 60%.
00;23;40;04 - 00;24;04;22
Carly
From our research, 60% of 50 workers 50 and older have said that they would love to learn new skills, for their job or on the job. So first, eliminating or tearing down those those preconceived notions of stereotypes about older workers and technology, because the data showing different but also get out there and learn it, experiment with it.
00;24;04;23 - 00;24;29;10
Carly
We talk about obviously AI, everyone's talking about AI and using it, on the job, using it in your, personal life. Experiment with it, try different platforms, ask it different questions, practice learning and improving your prompts and, you know, help others. Talk to others about it. Talk to your younger colleagues. Talk to other older colleagues that you work with.
00;24;29;12 - 00;25;05;29
Carly
About different new platforms or things they're seeing that they're or they're doing or experimenting with. And we talk a lot about in the you know, obviously, I think in the news recently, there's been a lot about AI taking over jobs. I think we're seeing it a little bit more in entry level positions at the moment. But older workers, you know, are also nervous about the uncertainty of how I might show up in the workplace or what positions or jobs it might take over human skills, human durable skills, or those power skills or soft skills that come with decades of being in the workforce.
00;25;06;05 - 00;25;45;17
Carly
I cannot replicate, you know, there's good communication skills, mentorship, leadership, problem solving skills that you gain over time. And so we're finding that those are still highly valued skills, and skills that employers are looking for. So older workers need to lean into that and make sure that they are communicating that they have all those skills and bring those to the table, as well as if you're in, a job and making sure that you're, you're using those skills with, your younger cohorts or mentoring younger, employees on some of the skills that you've learned over time.
00;25;45;19 - 00;26;10;15
Carly
So I would just recommend experimenting, playing around with this new technology. Don't being a don't be afraid of it. And and knowing that keeping the human in the loop on a lot of this AI technology is still really important in that context that, older employees might have or bring to the job is going to be super important even when using AI.
00;26;10;18 - 00;26;44;26
Carly
You mentioned, you know, my husband's a graphic designer, but he's an illustrator by trade. And so there's, you know, graphic designers coming out of school that don't know how to draw, and they don't necessarily need to anymore due to the technology, shifting. But when I think about marketing, for example, if you for your whole career have 30 years or 20 years of experience writing a good marketing plan, a good mix of of marketing channels and different, avenues for, for promoting whatever you might be promoting.
00;26;44;28 - 00;27;15;09
Carly
And all of a sudden, yes, I could probably write a really sophisticated marketing plan, but if you're someone just coming into the workplace and you haven't written marketing plans or you haven't done them before and seen, you know how they actually do and the data that comes out of them, you might not know the AI marketing plan that that spits out from, you know, using ChatGPT or, Claude is actually a good plan.
00;27;15;12 - 00;27;27;17
Carly
So we're finding that leap for older workers leaning into that contextual experience and knowledge that they have can really be helpful when pairing it with some of the new technology that's out there.
00;27;27;19 - 00;27;55;23
Jason
Excellent. I'm glad you shared that. I can't believe, you know, how much, how how far along we are in our conversation. I'm really enjoying it. And, I do want to make sure we get to some of the other items we want to talk about, because. And I feel like we've covered some of it, but the next thing I really want to dive into is what should someone do, Carly, if they're noticing ageism in their current workplace?
00;27;55;25 - 00;28;06;21
Jason
If it's happening to them, as an employee or perhaps they're perceiving or it is happening to them as an employment candidate, what would be kind of your recommendations there?
00;28;06;24 - 00;28;34;28
Carly
Sure. I would recommend first to document everything, just to have everything documented, dates, times, other people involved, perhaps, document everything, but also know your rights. So I mentioned before, we are fighting every day against age discrimination in the workplace here at AARP. And we have advocacy efforts both at the federal level and the state level.
00;28;35;00 - 00;29;15;26
Carly
And we have had some great success in states, working with our state legislators and our state local officials to pass legislation that prohibits employers from asking any age related information in the hiring and recruiting process. So if you feel that maybe, perhaps you weren't you didn't get a new job or a new opportunity based on your age, and you live in a state like Colorado, and you remember that if this employer or potential employer asked for any age related information during the recruiting process in Colorado, there is legislation that states and prohibits employers from asking that information.
00;29;15;26 - 00;29;27;00
Carly
So know your rights document. Talk to your HR representative if you feel that you are being discriminated against based on age or your direct supervisor.
00;29;27;02 - 00;29;38;07
Jason
Carly, is. Could it be considered age discrimination? If someone post a job and they describe it from the beginning as being an entry level position?
00;29;38;09 - 00;30;02;01
Carly
Not necessarily an entry level position. What we what we tend to to discuss when posting jobs and job descriptions is trying to eliminate caps on experience. So let's say it is an entry level job, but they are requiring maybe a year or two of some sort of skills and experience, in order, to do the job well.
00;30;02;04 - 00;30;33;21
Carly
And instead of saying 1 to 2 years of experience, we say just state at least one year of experience or experience in this industry is preferred so that someone who might have had an entire career doing something different, yet they might want to switch to doing, this new job or this new career. They might they might have managed people for decades, and now they want to be an individual contributor, but at a different life stage.
00;30;33;21 - 00;30;44;20
Carly
They have different priorities. They aren't looked at as overqualified or completely not even looked at as a potential candidate.
00;30;44;22 - 00;31;06;03
Jason
Yeah. Perfect. Thank you. I think that's really good. I made a note here just to review all of our, candidate, material to make sure we're not asking any age related type questions. And I also like the tip. You know, when people say, you know, 1 to 3 years of experience, or at least or something like that, then I'm like, why don't you just be more specific?
00;31;06;03 - 00;31;21;21
Jason
And is it one, is it three? You know, whatever. So, I like being more specific that way. Let's talk about, how department heads can better lead and support multi-generational teams.
00;31;21;23 - 00;31;57;04
Carly
Yes. So we educate a lot about the value of a multi-generational team. And by having a range of ages, either on group projects or within the team themselves, the different perspectives that can that can come out of that. We research shows that there's increased innovation, increased creativity, better problem solving. When you have a mix of ages, just like any sort of, mix of of different backgrounds or from different points of view, we do see the benefits, across the board for an organization.
00;31;57;08 - 00;32;23;18
Carly
So we advocate for inclusive cultures that benefit all employees. But also looking at with five generations in the workplace today, you know, most organizations do have a representation and a range of ages. And being more intentional about, what a multi-generational team or, organization and, and how that can benefit your bottom line.
00;32;23;20 - 00;32;43;26
Jason
Okay. Perfect. Carly, my next question is going to be, giving advice, for employees and coworkers to foster a safe, diverse and rewarding work environment. So what are your tips there? And best practices?
00;32;43;28 - 00;33;12;08
Carly
Yeah, as a manager, we have most of us are managing people older than us and younger than us. Right? I mentioned five generations in the workforce. We also have educational resources for employers on managing mixed age teams. And we hear that it's sometimes a pain point for organizations. But in our research, it shows that over 90% of people enjoy working with people of different ages.
00;33;12;11 - 00;33;38;08
Carly
Also, when looking at specifically older workers, research shows that 77% of people value working with older colleagues and value the skills and experience that those older colleagues bring to the job. So there are things like as a manager that, you know, I tend to to look to help within my team, in my organization, and that's acknowledging that there are different communication styles.
00;33;38;08 - 00;34;01;26
Carly
And that might not always be an age thing. Right? That just might be a preference thing. But personality types, the people I work with, if you know how they prefer to communicate, do they prefer email or phone or teams? And then making sure that they know my expectations I prefer. Or usually I'm checking email the first thing I do when I get up.
00;34;01;28 - 00;34;18;28
Carly
Obviously all day long at the office when I'm not in meetings. And then the last thing I do before, you know, plugging in my device and and turning off the lights. So if you need to reach me or you want me to respond, making sure that, it's in an email and you'll know that I'll be checking that and getting back to you.
00;34;18;28 - 00;34;49;00
Carly
So setting expectations for communication is is a big one. Also flexibility. We know from all the research that no matter which generation or you're how old you are, people want flexibility. They want work life balance, and they want to be respected and compensated for the work they do. And that is consistent across the board. And so we've we've worked with a lot of employers who have added flexible work arrangements into their organizations.
00;34;49;03 - 00;35;16;25
Carly
Remote work, hybrid work, part time work or just different schedules, where you might be coming in later and leaving later or coming in earlier and leaving earlier. Those types of, flexible arrangements can help people of all generations. We also talk about other benefits that might benefit, that might help with, an older working population. And those are things like phased retirement plans or programs.
00;35;16;27 - 00;35;33;28
Carly
We here at AARP have caregiving leave. So if I needed to go take care of my aging parents who don't live in Washington, DC, I can take time. Not out of my own sick leave or vacation leave to do that and and help as a family caregiver.
00;35;34;00 - 00;35;54;18
Jason
Nice. That sounds like a very good employment benefit. Talk to me as as we're wrapping up, I want to I don't think we have time to go deep in this, but I don't want to ignore it also. And that is earlier you mentioned, you know, some of the data points of, women and minorities in the workplace.
00;35;54;21 - 00;36;09;08
Jason
Is there anything you wanted to share, further or in addition to that? Or just maybe if if somebody who identifies of those, areas with, you know, what advice would you give to them? Here.
00;36;09;10 - 00;36;19;24
Carly
Yeah. I mean, well, ageism and age bias isn't isn't fair. It's also expensive. Right. And so it
00;36;19;26 - 00;36;26;24
Carly
in 2018 alone, ageism cost the US economy about $850 billion.
00;36;26;29 - 00;36;27;12
Jason
Wow.
00;36;27;17 - 00;36;43;27
Carly
And if nothing changes or nothing's done, that number could increase and ballooned to over $4 trillion by 2050. And what I think people don't realize is that people over 50 contribute more than $8 trillion to the economy each year.
00;36;44;00 - 00;36;59;10
Carly
So hiring older workers is not not only good for your organization and having that multi-generational mix within your organization to increase innovation and creativity and problem solving, but it's also good for the economy.
00;36;59;12 - 00;37;11;08
Carly
And as we as a country see these demographic shifts, I mean, by 2034 there are going to be more people 65 and older than 18 and younger for the first time in our country's.
00;37;11;10 - 00;37;11;22
Jason
Right.
00;37;11;25 - 00;37;34;00
Carly
We are also seeing 65 plus 75 plus as the fastest growing segments of the labor market. And so if you're not thinking about that or adjusting your culture or your organization to support just the changing demographics themselves, people working longer, you need to be thinking about that.
00;37;34;02 - 00;37;48;27
Jason
So help me understand. So, and not employing older workers is costing our economy. Help me kind of give me some examples of, of of how that, manifests.
00;37;49;00 - 00;38;18;27
Carly
So imagine you are 58 and you are you own a home, you're paying a mortgage. You might have children in college, you might have aging parents that need care. And all of a sudden you lose your job. Research shows that 10% of older workers, when they lose a job, are pushed out of a job. Only 10% are making the same amount of money or more when they reenter the workforce.
00;38;18;29 - 00;38;55;01
Carly
And so what we're seeing is that is hurting people's economic security, their retirement security. And so making sure that older jobseekers, if you've been pushed out or you've left or you want to reenter or you've needed to take a break, in the labor market to possibly be a family caregiver or for some other medical reason to make sure, as I mentioned before, the things we we are making sure that we let older jobseekers know is use your network, network, network network, network network.
00;38;55;01 - 00;39;20;11
Carly
Like I said, talk to your neighbors, talk to your former colleagues you've worked with. Reach out to folks who you might volunteer with or if you're involved, and a faith based organization, when you're walking the dog, if you run into a neighbor, just your family, anyone. Because we still see that time and time again. People are getting new job opportunities through people they know or through opportunities of someone who knows someone.
00;39;20;13 - 00;39;49;28
Carly
So using your network, making sure that you're staying up to date on these changing and evolving technology resources. So you might have been in the job for 2025 years. You might not ever had. You never had to do a virtual interview, making sure you're preparing for that. There's all sorts of tools and technology we just launched a collaboration with, indeed, where we have a co-branded job board where older workers can find millions of job opportunities out there.
00;39;50;01 - 00;40;18;07
Carly
They can get help with their resume, either through a free resume scan or resume writing packages. There's interview prep and there's one on one coaching, so there's a ton of resources out there to make sure that you're prepared and that you are seeing on top of sort of the changing, labor market, you know, demands as well as the technology that is that has changed over the years.
00;40;18;09 - 00;40;40;26
Jason
Perfect. That's, that's great information. I've just made a note to myself. I need to do more networking within my own network as well. And let them know, you know, what I'm up to and what I'm looking for. You know, both, with candidates, with, clients with, you know, service providers, etc.. You know, you're reminding me of a, of a cliche of, you know, your network is your net worth.
00;40;40;29 - 00;40;55;29
Jason
And, and, you know, there's also the cliche of, you know, it's who you know, but I actually think it's not we I think we think about that wrong. I think it's not who we know, but it's who knows us. So in other words, I, you know, I could know somebody very famous, but they're not going to know me.
00;40;56;01 - 00;41;18;22
Jason
But if that famous person knew me, that might be good, you know, economically for my pocketbook. Right. So I always try to encourage people to make sure that they're known, not just that they know people, but, you know, early in my career, I definitely benefited from having the ability to pick up the phone, have a conversation with somebody who could connect me or or do something and obviously look for ways to pay it forward first.
00;41;18;22 - 00;41;33;28
Jason
So, yeah, I think this is good. This has been a really good conversation. Carly, I appreciate you coming on and sharing your smarts and insights with our audience. Is there anything that we didn't get a chance to address that you wanted to make sure we share with our audience today?
00;41;34;01 - 00;41;57;27
Carly
Yeah. Thank you so much, Jason, for having me. This has been a wonderful experience. And I would just say for those job seekers or anyone looking to change careers, you can find all these resources at aarp.org/work. And again, we have tons of resources and educational materials for the employer side, as well. So guides on managing mixed stage teams.
00;41;57;29 - 00;42;12;25
Carly
Say this, not that as well as, intergenerational guides, ways for employers to set up intergenerational ergs or to add things like caregiving benefits to their, their suite of benefits for employees.
00;42;12;28 - 00;42;44;15
Jason
I love that, and, thank you for the hard work and advocacy of your organization. For you coming on, the show today to share these insights. And, yeah, I think that's, very, very helpful and insightful and hopefully that, you know, somebody is, you know, encouraged to be an agent of change within their organization and that somebody has been able to, you know, improve their applicant, process, both as an employer and potentially as an employee.
00;42;44;15 - 00;43;01;02
Jason
So if just those things start happening, among our audience, I imagine this would be really good for everybody, both, their, their employment fulfillment, the economy in so many other ways. So, Carly, thanks again for, being a great guest.
00;43;01;05 - 00;43;02;19
Carly
Thanks so much for having me.
00;43;02;21 - 00;43;21;10
Jason
Yeah. Thank you. All right. So with that, this has been another episode of On Top of PR. If you benefited from this episode, please take a moment and share it with a friend or colleague who you think would benefit from consuming it as well. You can send them a link to on top of pr.com. Also, while you're there, do me a favor.
00;43;21;10 - 00;43;35;01
Jason
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00;43;35;04 - 00;43;47;13
Announcer
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Topics: On Top of PR, artificial intelligence
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